International Student Mental Health: Malaysian Counsellor Yi Tong Tew on Identity, Belonging, and Finding Support in Melbourne

⚠️ Content warning: This episode discusses suicide and sexual assault. Please listen with care and use the support services listed below if you need them.

🎁 Free mental health information for international students: Download "International students and mental health" → HERE

How do international students navigate identity, mental health, and belonging when studying abroad in Australia? In this episode, we hear from Yi Tong (Ethan) Tew, a Malaysian-born Chinese counsellor, founder of Comfy Counselling, and proud "Gaysian" living in Melbourne.

Yi Tong shares his lived experience of moving to Australia at 17, studying in Melbourne, and later becoming a practising therapist and lived experience worker. His story reflects the challenges many international students and Asian Australians face when accessing culturally competent mental health support in Australia.

Please note that we interviewed Yi Tong using his English name, "Ethan", however since recording this episode, Yi Tong prefers to be referred to by his name, Yi Tong.

🎧 You'll hear about: 

✅ Mental health challenges faced by international students in Melbourne 
✅ Coming out as LGBTQIA+ to conservative Asian parents 
✅ Why Medicare doesn't cover international students and what alternatives exist 
✅ Finding culturally responsive counselling as a Malaysian Australian 
✅ Reframing emotions as "data points" - a culturally adapted approach to therapy 
✅ How Asian Australian mental health practitioners can better support international students

 Watch the episode below or find us on Spotify or Apple Podcasts!

💡 Episode Highlights: 

In this conversation, Yi Tong and Asami discuss:

• Coming out to conservative parents and what family acceptance looks like over time
• The loneliness of studying in Melbourne as an international student without support
• Why Medicare doesn't cover most international students, and what mental health options exist instead
• Struggles with suicidality, and how therapy with a culturally competent counsellor helped him survive and reconnect
• Reframing emotions as "data points" - a culturally responsive approach to self-understanding for Asian Australians
• How cultural competency in Australian mental health services can better support international students
• His passion for healthy gaming habits as part of his counselling practice in Melbourne

✨ This episode is especially relevant for:

• International students in Melbourne seeking mental health support
• Asian Australians looking for culturally responsive therapy
• LGBTQIA+ individuals from conservative Asian backgrounds
• Anyone curious about culturally competent and inclusive counselling practices

🧠 Key Insights from Yi Tong: 

• "Emotions aren't problems to fix - they're data points telling us something important about our experience."
• "Finding a therapist who understood both my Malaysian background and my identity as a gay Asian made all the difference."
• "International students face unique mental health challenges, and the system isn't always set up to support us."

👤 About the Guest 

Yi Tong Tew is a Malaysian-born Chinese counsellor, founder of Comfy Counselling, and advocate for culturally responsive mental health care. Based in Melbourne, Yi Tong specialises in working with international students, Asian Australians, and LGBTQIA+ communities. He brings a unique approach that integrates cultural understanding with evidence-based therapy, including exploring healthy gaming habits as part of holistic wellbeing.

📱 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/comfycounselling/

🔗 Website: https://www.comfycounselling.com/

🔗 Find Yi Tong and other Asian Australian counsellors via the Asian Mental Health Practitioners List

🛠️ Resources mentioned:

• Dr K's Youtube account: https://www.youtube.com/c/HealthyGamerGG

🙌 Connect with Shapes and Sounds Instagram & LinkedIn: @justshapesandsounds Website: https://justshapesandsounds.com

🆘 Support Services (Australia)

• Lifeline: 13 11 14 (24/7 crisis support)
• Beyond Blue: 1300 22 4636
• QLife: 1800 184 527 (3pm–midnight, LGBTQIA+ peer support)
• Suicide Call Back Service: 1300 659 467

Please note Shapes and Sounds is not an emergency service.

If you're outside Australia, please check local crisis hotlines in your country.

💬 If you found this episode meaningful, please share it with a friend, leave us a review, and subscribe so other international students and Asian Australians can find the Asian Mental Health Podcast. Your support helps us reach those who need these conversations most. 💛

~ 

Transcript

Hi there, it’s Asami with you here.

Today’s conversation talks about suicide and sexual assault so please approach this carefully. If hearing about suicide doesn’t feel right for you today, please skip to another episode or return at another point in time.

Ethan Tew, is a Malaysian born Chinese counsellor, and founder of Comfy Counselling. He moved to Australia in 2015 as an international student and he proudly calls himself a “Gaysian” and a “huge gamer!”

As gentle, and warm as Ethan is, you’ll hear that he’s endured a difficult relationship with suicide, Bipolar Disorder and coming out to his conservative parents. And he shares how he overcame all these challenges in a way that worked for him and his family.

It’s a really important story which I’m honoured to share with you. 

~

Asami: Well, hi, Ethan. Thank you so much for joining us today. 

Ethan: Hi, Asami. 

Asami: I love that you use the term Gajan. Can you please tell us what the term gajan means to you? What a funny place to start, right? I know. 

Ethan: I love the term gaysian. It truly encapsulates who I am as a person I think. I love all things asian, all things gay. 

Asami: And so simply stated. 

Ethan: I simply stated, you know, and it's interesting because for a really long time, I pushed that part of myself out, especially my gay identity and also even my Asian identity as well when I first came here to Australia many years ago. 

Asami: Yeah, well. As a proud Gaysian now. What was it like coming out to your parents? 

Ethan: I was 19. I was here in Australia then. I was still a student. I was studying and yeah, one day I spoke to my parents on Skype. Wow, we haven't heard that word in a long time. So I spoke my parents on Skype and I was just like, you know, just our usual monthly catch up. We're just chatting away on what's been happening in my life. Their lives, what's going on with my grandparents and stuff, and then I suddenly had the courage to speak up about myself because I almost never share about myself and I thought, okay, you know what, it's time. And I say this all in Chinese because I actually even had to Google the words bisexual at that time. But then... That was what I thought I was, but I just love men now, so... 

Asami: Yeah, just to be clear. Okay. So you had to Google the translations so that you knew what you were going to say. 

Ethan: So I had practiced it in my head, and I remember telling them, well, I'll say it in English, I wanna let you know I am a bisexual. And there was just silence. And I thought that the call had, I thought it was lagging. Their faces were frozen as well, and I was like, uh, hello? And then they started talking about something else. I was, like, oh, they probably didn't hear it. 

Asami: Oh, interesting. Hang on. So was it frozen or were they just? 

Ethan: So, a couple months later, I had gone back to Malaysia and I was like on my way to a relative's house with my mom. We were just in a car, we were just hanging out and just before we were about to, I guess, leave our car, I asked my mom, did you hear what I said couple months ago about me being bisexual? My mom. We heard you and and i guess i was just a bit stunned by what she kind of said after she told me If you ever get a boyfriend, I would kill myself. 

Asami: And how did you respond in that moment? 

Ethan: I think I was just flabbergasted. I was shocked. I was dysregulated and she said this just before we were leaving the car and yeah I was just trying to collect myself before I walk into my relatives house and then everyone was just like acting their jolly self, my mom as if nothing had happened and I was in complete disbelief that my mom had just said that as   a casual thing to say to your 19 year old son. 

Asami: And it was said in kind of a, like not in an angry way or no, not much emotion behind how she said it. 

Ethan: Before she said that, I remember her crying. I remember tears streaming down her face. But then when she said, Her face seemed like a wall, it looked like a wall. It was as if she was almost protecting herself from the truth. 

Asami: What do you think, looking back now on your 19-year-old self in that situation? I feel like my heart is breaking hearing that. 

Ethan: I see that 19 year old self, like 19 year-old Ethan is incredibly strong for maintaining his composure all those years. And also incredibly sad as well that he had to keep all of that in to himself because he didn't really have a very supportive network then. 

Asami: And then did that visit to Malaysia kind of end and then you returned to Australia for your next semester. Is that sort of how it happened? 

Ethan: No, um, it kind of went on for a couple more weeks I remember my mom would suddenly come up to me and ask me whether The things that I do Make me gay Or make me bisexual like she would ask me like oh, why do you like dancing? And she never gets to her point Underneath her tone, I can tell that she is insinuating that the things that I do are what is making me gay, making me queer. 

Asami: And she's questioning those things. Yeah, right. Yeah. How did you respond in those situations? 

Ethan: I think I held my ground a lot with her. And it's funny because growing up, I'm incredibly conflict avoidant, but with her interrogating me about like all these things, I find that I stood my ground along with her, I told her that, you know, men and women can dance even when they're straight. Dance is just a beautiful thing that people do. It's not just a gay thing, you know? It's just, yeah. It's dancing. Yeah, it's just dancing. 

MX in - Talk To Me

Asami: What do you think that kind of strength? Comes from. 

Ethan: I don't know where that strength came from, but I really appreciated that it just happened. I think that strength might have come from me realizing that this is not right. I noticed that. Maybe my mom is not at right at everything. I think that was a big learning moment for me. 

MX out

Asami: Can you tell me a bit about your childhood and where you grew up and then how you came to Australia? 

Ethan: Oh definitely, so I grew up in a town. Malaysia, and it's kind of like a town, a big-ish town, but it seemed like everywhere we go, people just kind of knew each other. I go out to a restaurant, my dad would bump into his friend, or we go to another restaurant and my mom would bump in to her friend, it's just so hard. One degree of separation everywhere, yes. Exactly. And I grew up in a boarding school. Since I was 12 years old. And this is where I think I'm quite privileged because people don't normally go to a private school, especially boarding school as well. And yeah, my dad wanted me to have, I guess, a really good life ahead of me. And I think that was also where I kind of got to. Understand myself a bit more as well, even though I had a pretty rough time back in boarding school 

Asami: Yeah, can you describe the boarding school to me? I'm always so curious and you know how you just see movies about boarding schools. 

Ethan: Yeah, yeah. 

Asami: What did your school even look like? 

Ethan: So it's a co-ed school. So we had like boy houses and girl houses. And of course I was in the boy houses. And so yeah, in like your first year, you are sleeping in the same room with five other people. And yeah, it's like Everyone goes to bed around the same time. Everyone almost gets up around the time as well. There's like a big shower room and people just like, yeah, take turns. 

Asami: And then you eat your meals together and then you like get ready and then go down the hall to your classroom. 

Ethan: Yes, exactly. 

Asami: It's all the same building. 

Ethan: Yeah, all the same building, yeah. And in like the boarding school, you can quite clearly see the cliques and like the groups all forming. And I guess I grew up gaming a lot. And so I naturally fit it in with the gaming group. 

Asami: But were you allowed to play games at boarding school? 

Ethan: Yes, we were allowed to, except, yeah, because there are set periods where we had to study. So like it was after dinner time, I think, 730 p.m. To like 9 p. M. You have to like study and there'll be health tutors, the rooms just to make sure that you are actually studying. Yeah. And we would like get a lot of homework and stuff like that. So that that is literally the time that we will be doing a homework. 

Asami: Wow. 

Ethan: And we get like maybe an hour between 9 to 10 before bedtime. 

Asami: And then bedtime at 10? Yes. And then wake up at? 

Ethan: Um, six, seven or six 30. Yeah. Um, some people wake up earlier just so that they can have some peace in the shower. 

Speaker 3: Yeah, well. 

Ethan: Such as me, and just like, that is, it's a sensory overload. 

Asami: Yeah. Right. 

Ethan: They're like what six cubicles and literally uh 10 boys are right there um four of them are just standing in front of the the doors or like yeah just brushing their teeth and whatnot everyone's Yeah 

Asami: Yeah, no privacy. 

Ethan: No privacy, no. 

Asami: And then from there, at what age did you move to Melbourne? 

Ethan: I was 17 when I moved, yeah, so pretty young. I didn't move here with any family. A cousin of mine had already been studying here in Melbourne and I moved here with a high school mate. 

Asami: And did you, were you also boarding somewhere there, like once you came here or did you have an apartment or? 

Ethan: Yeah, I had to board somewhere first because I was under 18 at that time, it was a legal obligation for me to actually be under supervision and it just so happened yeah, a boarding sort of house kind of took us in, it wasn't a big one like my old school. I think there were roughly like 20 people but there are like different units and stuff that and yeah this was this was like 2015 

Asami: Were you excited to move to Australia? Or was it like a positive experience that moved? 

Ethan: I was incredibly excited because I wanted to separate myself from my Asian identity then. I think I had a lot of resentment. My Asian self because it felt like, I guess, I did not know this at that time, but because it's incredibly difficult for me to really feel like I could be myself. And I think a part of me was just finding it really hard to cope with being Asian because it feels like if I ever show to people that I'm gay. I would be rejected for it, even by my own Asian community. 

Asami: I see, I see. So it's almost like if you were white, then being gay might have been an easier experience or that's how you understood it. 

Ethan: Yes, that's how I understood it. That's, I guess, what the media was sort of portraying to me then. And I thought, oh, you know, coming straight up would be, would be great. Yeah. But then, you now moving here, you kind of realize that that's not the whole reality, right? There's still so much work to be done to normalize it. 

Asami: To normalize coming here or? 

Ethan: Come being gay just being you in general 

Asami: Tell me about some of those challenges that you faced as a new migrant and an international student to Melbourne. 

Ethan: I think the biggest challenge for me was fitting in. Finding the community which you can really connect with. Because for me, as a Gaget, and also as an international student, this intersectionality, it's... It's complicated because I'm hanging out with other international students, but they may also have the same worldviews on gay people. I may not feel very accepted there. And then there's also like hanging out with Australians. I struggled a lot initially because I find it really hard to know the same kind of similar interests and stuff. I realized how different. Our interests were like, even in terms of sports, for example, Malaysians play a lot of badminton, Australians don't play badmintn as much. I've never really heard of cricket until I came here. Yeah, cricket's not really a thing back in Malaysia. 

Asami: No, it's not a thing. 

Ethan: Uh... 

Asami: Like wherever you went, you couldn't quite find the clique. 

Ethan: Exactly. Yeah. 

MX in - Holding on

Asami: Did you find any other Gaijans in those early years? 

Ethan: In those early years, no. Because I think a lot of gay people would probably be able to relate to me is that Grindr and all the other gay dating apps. Like at first it's like, oh, so fun, so interesting. It's like oh, you get to just like talk to people here and there, but then quickly I think you notice like oh there's a lot emphasis on how you look. And then there's also this whole thing about race as well. I think a lot of people prefer to be with their own race. Yeah, it's a whole other journey there. 

MX out

Asami: Ethan, you shared with me some really difficult experiences that you've had, especially considering your story around suicide. And it's obviously not an easy conversation to have, but I'm just really grateful that you're open to talking about your experiences. I think it's really important, especially within the International Student Cohort as well to be talking about suicide. So I wanted to ask you if you could share your experience with us. 

Ethan: I guess my relationship with suicide started when I was like 14 years old. Like I said, I didn't really have a good time growing up in boarding school, especially when I guess the common insult that boys at that time kind of threw around was the F slur. I think, yeah, there was just a lot of fear in me, especially when like I had many crushes on boys. Around my age. and I guess I thought I had sort of a reprieve When I came here to Australia when I was 17. I was like, oh hooray 

Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm free! 

Ethan: But no, I guess my identity ties in a lot with my suicidality because I was just trying to find my place in the world, trying to understand the meaning of it all. And I think it spiraled in the third year of my undergraduate degree when I had a being sexually abused. And I think that was the tipping point for me. It was as if the storm had just rained down on me and I couldn't really see anything else. I didn't know what else I could do besides. It was the only thing I felt like I had control in my life then, whether I get to live or not. 

Asami: Well, that was the only decision that you had left, essentially. 

Ethan: Yeah, it felt like that, yes. So I did try to kill myself. I almost fell off a building, but then I managed to caught myself in time. And yeah, I was just bawling my eyes out. I still remember how the carpet was just like completely trenched for my tears. And then I thought, maybe, just maybe, I can get help. Maybe I do deserve some help. So I did, yeah, went to get some help 

Asami: Like in that darkest moment, there was like a little voice inside that was like, maybe you can get some help. Tell me what it was like to then go and seek help. 

Ethan: It was strange because I've just tried to end my life and now I'm doing the exact opposite. I'm trying to save it. I went to my university clinic and then thankfully, even with my student health card, I could get in psychiatry, but I had to pay. Psychology out of my own pocket, and thankfully University of Melbourne then had, I don't know whether they still have it, like student psychologists, they would like run low-cost fee sessions for people, and that was what I did. And I think with a psychiatrist and a psychologist, it helped me a lot. I think it helped me to really feel less alone and yeah bunch of therapy after trying out medications and I guess one of the things that my psychologist and I were working on a lot was how to make friendships and how to be more of myself And I think I was neglecting a lot of myself. Even like make any sort of genuine connections with people. So yeah, that's that was what I did. 

Asami: Incredible really to think about something within you that was like not yet, hey. Thank you for sharing that with me. I also want to ask you Ethan, people don't really talk about what happens after an attempt of suicide too. It's almost like someone suicides and then their life continues, but I cannot imagine that it's easy either, you know? What happens after and attempt and I know therapy is a part of it, but does that feeling of wanting to suicide go away. 

Ethan: It doesn't really go away. I think it kind of just sits in your mind. So let's, I guess, imagine this space right here and this not exactly a cube, but. 

Asami: Almost. 

Ethan: I think initially it just kind of sits beside you and I guess I've learned to speak with it in a way. I've learnt to understand why it's there as well. I think for me suicide is a form of escapism and it's a way of telling me that I'm in deep trouble. And what my friend said to me still resonates with me is that maybe we could see our emotions as data points, that we can see it as like a way of signifying to us that something is wrong, maybe we shouldn't do something about it. And I think I've learned to communicate with my suicidality. It now sort of tells me. There is something that's making me feel like I'm not being myself, I'm not connected to the people connected with the world. And then that's where I guess start to find out what that is. 

Asami: Like you're not afraid of it. 

MX in - Computer Wiz

I like that, data point, I'm gonna remember that. It kind of takes the intensity out too, doesn't it? 

Ethan: Too, doesn't it? It does. 

Asami: It's like just a point of information that I'm receiving. 

Ethan: Yes, yes. 

Asami: And then allows you to kind of pause and check in with yourself to be like, all right, what's going on with me? 

Ethan: Exactly

Asami: Were your parents aware of all of this that was happening to you? 

Ethan: Not until afterwards, there were times where I had told them I was depressed. The usual sort of like, I guess, response that I would get is like, oh, don't think about it too much, don't t think about too hard. 

Asami: Even the tone of you saying that, you're like a different person, don't worry about it. 

Ethan: Yeah. And it's like they took it really lightly or they didn't really see the seriousness of it. And Thinking about it now. They didn't know how to I think it was definitely more because they've never really learned how to support someone going through suicidality and because it is also what I guess they've kind of grown up with as well and I guess also what they've seen probably from their own experiences that people who are so happy go lucky like that doesn't seem like the world problems are on their shoulders at all. 

MX out

Asami: Yeah. I want to ask you about your experience of therapy which you've shared, but firstly, after your suicide attempt, how did you work out where to go? 

Ethan: The irony of it is that I was a psychology student then, so I kind of knew where to go, but I don't think I deserved to get help. Because I had this thought where, oh, if I'm a psychology student, I should be fine. Like if I am going to be a therapist, I should, be able to take care of myself, right? So I guess I was just holding it all together and then everything just kind of fell apart there, yeah. And then I guess, I had already known that I couldn't get a mental health care plan. Through my GP there. But then when I went to the GP, they told me that I can't get a mental health care plan because I'm not an Australian permanent resident or citizen. And I thought, wow, like the university lied to me. Yeah. I was like, hmm. Luckily, yeah, like I said, I was like. 

Asami: Cause like you thought the uni had said you can get your mental health plan, go to the GP and then you did that and you're like, Oh no, I can't. 

Ethan: I couldn't, yeah. But then they were able to refer me to a psychiatrist, which was also at the university clinic as well. Yeah. My, my GP referred me to him and then I had my first session a week after, which was surprisingly quick. And he recommended me to see, um, one of the student psychologists as well. Um, especially since I can't really quite afford a proper credited psychologists yet. 

Asami: Did you receive any diagnoses or yeah, talk me through that. 

Ethan: I did not receive a proper diagnosis, but my psychiatrist told me that, well, only after I asked him, so one day I randomly came up to him with a question like, oh, what do you think my diagnosis is? Well, to be honest, I'm not quite sure. And he told me that he didn't want to confine me to a diagnosis. Back then, I thought, wow, like, why can't you just diagnose me and tell me what I have? Why don't you know the answer? Well, yeah, you should be the one with the answers here, not me. And thinking back now, I really appreciated that because I don't realize at a time that I didn't want to be labeled with anything. He told me that perhaps your symptoms or what you're experiencing was closely related to bipolar disorder type two or seasonal depression. 

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. Yeah. 

Ethan: M 

Speaker 3: Hmm, okay. 

Ethan: And he told me, try not to get too fixated on the diagnosis, what we're doing here, we're treating your symptoms, what you're experiencing. And I think he was, I guess a psychiatrist ahead of his time in a way, yeah. 

Asami: That's what it sounds like. 

Ethan: Yeah, yeah. 

Asami: I know he says don't fixate on the diagnosis, but I'm going to ask two questions. What is type 2 bipolar disorder? 

Ethan: So type two bipolar disorder is a mood disorder, and it's classified by how you experience depressive cycles and occasionally a hypomanic cycle. So mania is when you experience this incredible feeling like you can take on the world, but it comes with a huge cost where it makes you reckless. It makes you. Impulsive. Let's say you're gambling and. Literally, you're just letting the wheels be taken by someone else. 

Asami: And I'm gonna win. Yeah 

Ethan: Yeah, I'm gonna win. I'm going to get all the money here. And it's just yeah, it can be debilitating. 

Asami: Um... 

Ethan: And I guess with hypomania, it's not as serious as mania. 

Asami: Like not as pronounced, like, yeah, okay. It’s kind of like the baby version of a manic episode. 

And then seasonal depression, how would someone know the difference between, I don't mean to make this a joke, but you know, winter in Melbourne is awful, but what is that difference, what's that line between I hate winter versus seasonal depression? 

Ethan: I think. 

Asami: You're like, actually, everyone in Melbourne's got a single dimension. 

Ethan: Oh, yes, I do wonder about that sometimes because I do notice that I get depressed during winter and I've been wondering about whether there are strong connections between I guess seasonal depression and vitamin D deficiency. 

Asami: Yeah. 

Ethan: Because it's what I've been hearing lately, where if you have a good amount of vitamin D, your mood just seems to improve, your sleep improves. 

Asami: I think we're listening to the same podcast, we're on the same, that's exactly what I've been listening to today. 

Ethan: But back to your question. Honestly, I don't know. 

Asami: Yeah. 

Ethan: It's a question for the experts there. 

MX in - I Only Know Never

Asami: Now you're a therapist. How do your parents feel about your career as a therapist as a mental health practitioner now? 

Ethan: I think now they really respect my work because someone that my family knows went through a mental health episode and I was able to sort of like refer them to the right people and every time I go back I kind of tell them about the kind of work I do. They really see the benefits, the... The effort that I'm putting in as well, and how my work is greatly valued here in Australia. Unfortunately, not so much in Malaysia, but they see that it is incredibly worthwhile for me to keep doing the work that I am doing here. 

Asami: How do you interpret that? 

Ethan: I think my parents often, I guess, saw the worth of the role based on how much money you were earning and also, I guess, the prestige that we will have, you know, like Asians, you got to be a lawyer, you got to be an Asian four, yes. 

Asami: What is it, Doctor? 

Ethan: Doctor. 

Asami: Engineer? 

Ethan: I think it was a counten? A counten, oh yeah. I think he's four, yes. 

Asami: If that was a fifth, what would it be? 

Ethan: Um, a programmer. 

Asami: Programmer 

Ethan: Probably, yeah. 

Asami: Interesting, interesting, time-sensitive. 

Ethan: Of change. Times have changed. Okay. Okay. 

Asami: Yeah. 

Ethan: It's gotta, you know, keep up with the digital era. 

Speaker 3: Oh, yeah. 

MX out

Ethan: So yeah, but I think for my dad especially, because he hears how passionate I am in the work that I do, he begins to ask me questions related to mental health a lot. Like he would ask me like, oh, how would you best raise a child for one, was I guess one of the most revelating questions that he had asked me. And I guess there was one time where, um, we had a neighbor who was literally screaming at their kid for not doing their homework. And I couldn't believe what my dad was saying, or what even my mom was saying as well, that what the neighbor is doing to their kid, it's not going to help them. It's not gonna actually get them to do the homework. I was like, so stunned. 

Speaker 3: Excuse me? 

Ethan: My jaw literally literally dropped. I was like, oh my god 

Asami: These people have changed. 

Ethan: I know, like, who are you? Are you from my parents? 

Asami: Yeah. Interesting. So your work has even affected how they think about things, how they view the world as well. Yeah. Yeah. 

Ethan: And I think a lot of it came from just having many open conversations with them. And there were many moments where I had to be very headstrong and hold my ground as well, like I did with my mom back then. And I've think my parents have changed a lot and I think they've grown to really understand mental health. As a real thing, rather than just a cautionary tale. 

Asami: Do you feel like you've forgiven your mother for the comment that you shared right at the start about how she would kill herself if you ever dated a man? 

Ethan: I would say so. Yeah. It's definitely a memory that has been seared into my brain. Definitely forgiven her and I wonder as well how much of that was not wanting to see me getting hurt or What all wanting to? My dad getting hurt as well I Think my mom even though she said that she would I guess kill herself She didn't and she she even met my partner as well. She was initially, I guess, hesitant at first. She'd be like, oh, I know you have like a boyfriend, but maybe it's still good to get like a girlfriend. But I'm like, thanks, mom. I totally needed that. 

Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. 

Ethan: But then in the end, she stopped asking me and I think she really saw my partner and I as real partners and I thing she started asking questions about my future with them. You know how like probably another Asian parents would probably ask their kids like, oh, when are you gonna get married? When are you going to have kids? You're almost 30 now. Yeah! So yeah! 

Asami: Things are very different now. 

Ethan: Definitely it's it's evolved to a much better thing 

Speaker 3: Hmm 

Ethan: like a larvae to a butterfly, but wait, do the larvae turn into a butterfly? No, that's a caterpillar. You get what I mean, guys. 

Asami: Why does the lava turn into it like a fly or something? 

Ethan: Whoops. That is my bad. 

Asami: That sounds like an incredible journey. And I know that time often plays into things. Sometimes things just need time and relationships to heal. But it really sounds like you yourself to get from where you were to now. And we're like laughing about some of these really intense topics that we're talking about. That takes a lot of self work. I know you've been to therapy, but what is some, like... You things that you did that really helped you to become the you of today. 

Ethan: When I was back in Malaysia one time, and I was struggling a lot with my Malaysian identity, I was just there meeting my family and my friends, and my friend was just bringing me to a Taoist temple to sort of like, yeah, just support her, understand what she's been sort of going through. And one of the things that she told me about Taoist practice is, the way that they practice life. It's really letting go, living simply, laughing at the face. Failure and I think that really helped me because she told me about the laughing buddha in buddhism. She told me that a lot of what he was doing was when people were sort of just saying shit about him about buddhas or like uh or just a lot of bad things coming his way. All he did was he laughed it off uh and it resonated with me because I... Often don't find humor in a lot of things, but then when I, I guess, changed my perspective and I just tried to let go, I found that it was a lot easier for me to go through my everyday life. But you know, having said that, it's not easy to just let go right? 

Speaker 3: Hmm. 

Ethan: I guess it's about understanding what holding on does for you. Is it serving you a purpose? Maybe it served your purpose once, but now it probably doesn't. And I guess one of the things that they teach in Taoism is also you can often find truth and paradox. 

Asami: Hmm, you can often find truth in paradox. 

Ethan: So, I guess for example, you can't cast a shadow without light. 

Asami: I see, yep. Yeah. 

Ethan: And I think that phrase is just beautiful as well. 

Asami: Hmm 

Ethan: the band, you can't really see what's good. I guess it's similar to acceptance and commitment therapy, in a way. This is, I guess, what Russ Harris had said before, and I'm probably going to, like, completely mince his words off. 

Asami: Sorry, sorry Russ. Sorry Russ. That doesn't matter, you go. 

Ethan: Um, with caring comes pain. 

Asami: With caring comes pain. 

Ethan: I guess how I interpret it is that if it never really mattered to you, would it have hurt? And it's bittersweet, isn't it? As a response, I just laugh it off. I know that it matters a lot to me and it hurts and I try my best to just see the funny side to it. 

MX in - I Only Know Never

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm. 

Ethan: And yeah, I think it helps just laughing it off. 

Asami: Is there a difference between letting go and acceptance? 

Ethan: It's a fine line, isn't it? Yeah. I think letting go is when you've completely let go of the control of your control over it and you are learning to just flow with it. And I think maybe acceptance is also that as well. But I guess with acceptance you can still I guess choose to do something about it. 

MX out

Asami: I can see how incredible you would be to work with as a therapist. And now you are the founder of Comfy Counseling. I think that's a great name, by the way. Thank you. As a side note. And something that's, it's not unique, but I really appreciated this on your website. But you support people with healthy gaming habits because you yourself are a huge gamer, as you've shared. Down. 

Speaker 3: Oh, oh yes. 

Asami: So tell me about healthy gaming. I don't know. How much time do you have? Yeah, how much time to you have. 

Ethan: Oh, Asami, um... 

Asami: Where to begin, huh? 

Ethan: Where to begin? 

Asami: Okay I've got a question to begin. Yes. I have heard like just say multiplayer online games that they can get really intense and like a lot of bullying and misogyny and like crazy stuff get said. So then how does someone do that healthily? 

Ethan: Definitely. Ah, that is... Question that is incredibly complex, but I will, I'll try to pick it up. So I guess to build a healthy gaming environment is, it depends on what kind of game that you want to play. 

but it's about i guess finding your community there and i managed to find some friends that i can play with who are whom i can play with that make the experience a lot easier.

But I guess if you want to play in a multiplayer game like that, let's say League legends, you're bound to stumble upon. Uh toxic players unfortunately yeah. I look at what people are saying, and I just think, wow, they must be in such a place to say all these things.

And I guess with Gaming addiction, it's a whole thing with just wanting to escape, right? I think we can treat it the way that we would, I guess,  any sort of addiction as well. We wanna understand what's going on in this person's life. Why is it that they are choosing to escape using gaming? Gaming is... It's so good because there are often just an endless amount of rewards that you can get in games. But in real life, it's difficult because, you know, you do so much, you put in so much effort, but the rewards just don't seem as good in gaming. And I think that's probably why people get addicted to gaming. 

Asami: Don't mean. 

Ethan: Yes. Dopamine. And this is what Dr. K talks about in his book. He's a psychiatrist and I believe he's a Twitch streamer as well. His book about healthy gaming is sort of like tailored to parents who are wanting to, I guess, support their kids with gaming addiction. He talks a lot about delayed gratification, and learning that it's okay that rewards come later. And really just helping your kid to recognize that.

Asami: Interesting. I'll put a link to the Dr. K, his YouTube and that book that you mentioned as well. We'll put that in the show notes for everyone. Ethan, thank you so much for your time today and, uh, no doubt. There'll be so many young people who sit at that intersection of being queer, being Asian slash being a migrant or an international student. I think you're going to go on to do incredible work in your private practice. And it's an honor to have you on our practitioner list. It really is, you know, so thank you. 

Ethan: Your most welcome and thank you for letting me be on the show. 

Asami: And I'm going to do some promo for you. So Ethan, you are available on Instagram at comfy counseling. That's counseling with a double L. I know I thought it was one L, but you don't have some spell at one L. But sometimes it's two. But yeah. 

Ethan: I still don't know whether it's the Australian spelling or the American spelling. 

Asami: I think it looks better with two, it makes more sense. It does. Yeah, anyway, everyone, double L, right? And Ethan is also on LinkedIn, so you can look up Ethan there too. We'll put all the links in the show notes. But you can find us, Shapes and Sounds, on Instagram and LinkedIn. Just look for at Just Shapes& Sounds. Please subscribe to our podcast and leave us a review on whatever favorite podcast app that you're on. It really helps other people to find us. Download this episode for offline listening because as you heard, there are so many key moments in this conversation to return back to. And most importantly, please share this episode with your friends because word of mouth really helps us to destigmatize mental health within Asian communities. Please share this with any international students that you know, any queer young people who are Asian. This is a really, really important conversation. So thank you so much, Ethan. Thanks for being here. 

Ethan: You're most welcome. Thank you everyone.

Keywords: international student mental health Melbourne, Malaysian counsellor, Asian Australian LGBTQIA+, culturally responsive therapy, international student support Australia, Melbourne counselling, Asian mental health practitioners, cultural competency, Medicare alternatives international students